You can most definitely keep them off others land the majority of the time with the alpha and dogs that are broke to it,it's well worth the money, we all used to hunt years ago with no tracking collars, but those days are long gone, you hardly ever heard anyone complaining back then, so to make it easy on you and your neighbors, break them where u can catch them, then u can hunt a lot more than u look dogs, win win for everyone👍👍👍👍

The people who says a tracking collar can't keep them off others property are right ...... But a shock collar will. I want to be in 100% control of my dogs all the time so I can keep them on my land , break them off small deer , etc.

This is the darnest post...Mr Harris, if your dogs come home at nite thats cool, they must get tired quick on that 1000 acres running in circles all day...but still, 1000 acres and they dont get off it? Dont get on the neighbors property? Your right they sure aint pushing hard, but good for you I guess-

The guys that use e-collars to break off your deer chase...I guess you are using the tone...because if you use the other button they sure aint gonna run deer much longer after a few sessions of that- But i get your point.

Mr. Harris...these boys are telling you the truth about needing to know where your dogs are none the less...I am an old fashioned rabbit hunter and was not a believer in needing to know where they were. But its nice to know when they have treed, fell thru the ice in the swamp, fallen in a well around some old abandoned house...or, if they are actually at a neighboring property's house. You cant help the situation if you have no idea where they are.

Bubba Casper has a point, the only way to keep them off everyone else's property 100% of the time is to leave them in the pen.

Good Hunting
John Foster

Mr. Jones is 100% correct, you can set up a perimeter ( hunt club boundary) on the alpha. If a dog gets close to the perimeter the alpha will alert you, you tone, shock whatever it takes, don't take but a few times and the tone is all it takes,the dog will stop and go back to where it was turned out or to you and never step foot on someone else's property. Train your dogs to come when toned at home. I have chase registered walkers trained that way, it works if you are really concerned about keeping your hounds off other people's property. From reading the post on this subject over the past few months I don't think many of you are.

Being old school. will admit, I know very little about all the new bells and whistles on the market today Also, did not say our dogs never cross into neigbors property. I will also admit that I do not hear the complaints that others are saying are the peoblems in todays VA. deer woods.....All I am saying is that times, they are achanging and We all have got to find ways to get along with our neighbors and the non hunting community....If I have to get rid of my dogs...... I will no longer be a deer hunter.. The sport will not hold my interst!

This is a interesting post for many different reasons I believe there to be some good points and some terrible ones but that's natural with any discussion. The issue is not the type of dog nor the technology used while they play apart in the issue at hand they are far from the problem. The biggest issue is the style of hunting and dog used and the land hunted by the club hunting it. I hunt in central Virginia we are a "DOG ONLY" hunting club we hunt hard and we are very good at what we do and how we do it. We run high quality, breed up, FAST hounds that know how to move a piece of game and can run it like it is suppose to be run. We use Alpha systems and the dogs are broke to it. We have large land tracts to hunt but are capable of making small organized drives. We are a club a club is just another name for a team we move as a team, organize as a team, communicate as a team and hunt as a team. To my knowledge this year we have had no issues we make drives if the dogs get out of the drive we get in front of them tone them do whatever we have to catch them we have made multiple drives a day using the same dogs most of the time. We cast the dogs and hunt those dogs. I believe a lot of clubs are lacking this mentality and that is causing issues. There is a difference in turning dogs out and calling yourself dog hunting and actually dog hunting. It takes skill it takes understanding and it takes training, land and corpoeration to do it the right way.



But in all actuality most of the issues people hear about are small isolated incidents that are exaggerated and made to seem more than what it is. Which is what the VLA wants they want us to get worked up and argue amugst ourselves. They have fabricated ideas in there head and relayed those ideas through lies and properganda. They are nothing more than pot stir, power hungry, rich people with nothing better to do with their time.



All we can do as hunters is the right thing be kind to each other, your neighbors, and people in the community. Be respectful and hunt your hounds to the best of your abilities and try to make controlled organized drives in safe blocks of land that you have permission to hunt. All you can do as a person is try your hardest mend the bridges and remain in good standing with the people around you. You do this and develop a understanding with people you will be better off in the end.


Just my thaughts and mine alone

The problem is real whether its fabricated or not, because we are living it right now. GPS collars are a must have!!!
And it doesn't matter if its a beagle or walker hound, a GOOD dog will get up on something and run it until its either lost or killed or caught or broke off the track.

A big part of the problem is the mindset of everyone keeping and hunting huge packs of dogs. Seems everybody has a "pack" of dogs, which half of them don't make the grade. We need to cull harder and be more selective!!! Back in the 80s we all had a few dogs a piece, that made a PACK. We hunted that pack. Then the Fox pen fad hit. We all have seen "that guy" with 14 deer dogs in his truck, still looking for the other 3 or 4 that are miles apart. That's what we have to to eliminate. We all would have better dogs, and a better time if we weren't hauling so many. Now is the time to buy the ALPHA system and make your dogs handle like labs. If you cant do that you don't need deer dogs. If we don't shrink the numbers of dogs we cast in smaller blocks we are done for. End of story.

I just can't wrap my head around the idea that any responsible houndsman would think it's a good idea to not use tracking collars?? How would that in any way benifit the hound, the owner, the sport or the neighboring land owner for that matter? With all the dog shootings, thefts and "rescues" going on, all the bs that is posted on these hunting forums, everything that is all over the news and Facebook, it makes me question the original post.

Our dog club only carries 15 broke dogs, in different development! Being the clubs dog driver, I only turn loose 3-4 dogs per drive, we usually get in 4 drives per day. As stated! Our dogs are back in their pens by night fall. I have a two compartment box and turn loose in different sections of our property! Our dogs usually make their way back to where they were turned out! We also run straight leg beagles , they are not pushing the deer out of our property and our deer are killed by perimeter standees! They way we have hunted for over 30 years! Seems to work for us .. Without the added expense of the collars! Have talked to friends that claim to have dogs that run over 30 miles in a dog.... Too big and too fast for my liking! Too each , his own, I guess! Will see how this new age of deer hunting, a time with all the gadgets plays out... In the long run! Carry on, fellow dog hunters! Do your thing!

What is the best way to tone train dogs wit the alpha system to return to the cast site or pen

I do worry about the one Anti that we have in the area....With the tree strike rule, he could in fact shut us down...... I do know, being a small club,we can in afford all the gadgets that you guys are promoting here..... That's why I am not sure the Fl. model will solve the problems we dog hunters face. Not sure having tracking collars will either. We have a club ajoining our property, a club running ponies with GPS collars, they over run their 3,000 acres and we allow them to retrieve their hounds at the end of the day. We have no problem with that as we are on the receiving end of many of their chases.I think, generally speaking ,the views/complaints are larger than the tracking collars can solve.

Rooster, they dont have to have 5 acres to be a pain in the you know what. I had a man nail posted signs to his front poarch in Hobbsville one day while i was parked in front of his quarter of an acre. I'm not jokin', I could pee across his yard and not get his grass wet. If they can see it, they think they own it.

I agree. But unfortunately the writing is on the wall. As good as GPS collars allow deer hunters to keep up with their hounds, Its hard to keep up with them when they go in 10 different directions. The style of hunting will have to change some, because these folks get more and more people on their side and become more of a threat every year. They wont stop until we're done for. A lot of places around our way have big enough blocks where it hasn't gotten that bad. But Ive heard of several occasions where clubs turning loose too many dogs on 50 acres, and next door their not welcome. That mess has to stop. Another thing that needs to stop is folks hunting half @ZZ dogs. They hang up on someones property during the day and aint good enough to either continue on hunting, or come back or simply run the deer through the block. Unless its a large tract of land, a good dog wont stay on someones property long. He'll be outta there in 5 minutes. You know the ones Im talking about

Joe Harris, what is a "straight leg beagle"? That's a new one on me.

Be careful guys. This person sounds like a liar and fake. Reread what he's posted. I can't believe people actually hunt this way anymore.

Think what you will. Don't really care! Know a lot of small clubs that are old school and do not have/need all the high tech gadgets you guys use to kill ,er run deer. You can do your thing, will do ours....my point is, with todays dog hunting here in central Va., we all will be looking at empty kennels if we don't take a good look at what lays ahead. All the Tracking collars in the world is not going to save a tradition that has been enjoyed for many ,many years,Is far more complicated that a simple gadget.

Joe

Sounds to me ur more worried about loosing ur hunting rights with dogs.. I understand ur view in a sense. I feel like clubs need to realize that a 15 acre block is much too small with hounds run a bird dog or Beagle of some kind.. that's common since...

U say all the gadgets in the world won't help save this tradition, how ever the garmin of today can an will help 99% of the problem u go around with ur garmin an mark all ur way points hot spots whatever u prefer an u cast ur hounds u keep an eye on ur garmin an it will tell u exactly where ur dog is no guessing of what side the rive he or she is on an if it's crossing the rd goin on to another trac of land u will kno.. so in all do respect the collars an expensive gadgets are worth every penny.. jus my thoughts

Still waiting to hear what a straight legged beagle is....

Is it that thing where you tape up the joints of a beagle's leg making his leg "straight" so he can't bend his legs and therefore can't run as fast?
Do you put a beagle's legs in a cardboard toilet paper roll so it makes his legs straight and he can't run as fast?

Shall I continue to speculate?

There is a straight legged Beagle and a bench leg Baegle.Straight leg beagles are just one to two inches taller and looking at the chest down they don't have the bowed out legs,don't know if it is crossed with anything or not.I know it's not my conversation but just putting that info so you can look it up or ask a old time rabbit Hunter,Happy Holiday and HAPPY Hunting.

Mr joe Harris You still have not answered the question. What club we are talking about.

Lmao. Bench leg beagle and straight leg beagle.
Beagles are either 13" or 15" class.

Don't laugh it all off Beagle pro.com it will explain it to you .

Mr.Harris has no use for a garmin and I have no use for a dog that doesn't require one! lol